tv MSNBC Live MSNBC December 17, 2016 4:00am-5:01am PST
-- biggest con i think i've ever said. that said, monica crawly does have a place at the newschannel. so deputy security adviser it is. that is it for tonight. see you again tomorrow. msnbc live is next. good morning, everyone, i'm dara brown in new york at msnbc headquarters. it's 7:00 a.m. in the east. 4:00 a.m. out west. here's what's happening -- >> i mean you were nasty and mean and vicious, and you wanted to win, right? >> his thank you tour talking about his supporters as he trying to change his tune. what i can tell you is that the intelligence i've seen gives me confidence in their assessment that the russians carried out this hack. >> blame it on the russians. president obama talks about hacking and the election. reaction this morning to what the u.s. could do about it. a drone incident in international waters.
what message is china trying to send the u.s. after seizing an american underwater device? wintry blast. battling bit cold and snow across large parts of the country. where is it headed next? we begin with politics. donald trump touched down in orlando last night for the second-to-last stop on his post-election thank you tour. when the crowd broke out in a familiar chant, the president-elect responded in a new way -- >> lock her up! lock her up! >> that's so terrible. here's what i noticed -- four weeks ago just prior to -- and always prior to, you people were vicious, violent, screaming, where's the wall, we want the wall. in now you're laid-back, cool, mellow, right? you're basking in the glory of victory. and we're already getting to
work. >> meanwhile in new york, hillary clinton held an election postmortem with donors and explained what went wrong with her campaign with an assist from statistics expert nate silver. >> take it from nate silver who's pointed out that swing state voters made their decisions in the final days, breaking against me because of the fbi letter from mr. kennely. and nate silver believes, i happen to believe this, that that letter most likely made the difference in the outcome. >> outgoing first lady michelle obama sat down for an interview with oprah winfrey friday morning and reflected on her husband's now-famous 2008 campaign slogan. >> we feel the difference now. see now, we're feeling what not having hope feels like. you know? hope is necessary.
it's a necessary concept. >> today the president-elect will hold his last day of the thank you tour in mobile, alabama, where he took home nearly two-thirds of the vote on november 8th. joining me jane timm and jonathan allen, roll call columnist and co-author of "hrc." good to have you with us. >> good morning. >> donald trump last night suggested his supporters are cool and calm. is this him trying to pull back on some of the more inflammatory moments of campaigning? >> you know, i think this is one of those classic examples of the media taking trump literally. and the people, lifhis supporte saying he's joking with him, maybe taking him seriously but not as literally. i think for sure he is trying to encourage people to not be as angry as we've seen them at previous rallies. i think that probably doesn't look good for a president-elect on a thank you tour. nonetheless, i don't think the people rally were taking him as seriously as many were taking him this morning on that one
specific line. >> jonathan, while he may be trying to express a toned down environment, do the key positions in his administration affect a toned down approach? >> he's certainly not reaching out, compromising, putting together a team of rivals. and you know, there's not an effort to really, you know, get ideologically out of a particular box that you could point to an appointment or twor that might suggest little bit of that. nikki haley for the ambassador to the u.n. but basically he's brought up some hard-line conservatives, some people who i think reflect the way that he campaigned in a lot of ways. >> and interestingly enough, the president-elect did not mention russia in his remarks to supporters. so jane, what do you make of that? >> you know, i think that's -- that's not a win for him. when he's talking about going after the cia and condemning the intelligence that says that maybe russia tried to help him
win this election, i don't think it's a win for him. it's something that's going to get a crowd cheer. the thank you tours are about having a big crowd and applause line to boost him and push him into the mandate of office that he will take in january. >> jonathan, i want to move on to the hillary clinton comments. is it clear that the comey letter may have swung the election? is it what the donors wanted to hear from secretary clinton? >> i think there's still forensic work to be done. i think when we get a better idea of who showed up and who didn't, when voter files come out, we'll get a better feel for that. certainly the clinton campaign believes that that sort of changed the trajectory of the race. pretty much up and down, folks think the comey letter was important. the other question is when -- when the race should have been that close at that point to begin with. >> and jonathan, you talk about change. donald trump was supposed to be a news conference this wheek to explain how he would separate himself from his businesses. and he canceled that.
so jane, where do you think that leaves him with respect to potential conflicts of interest? >> that leaves him kicking this can down the road. i think this is one of the most concerning parts of the transition is that we don't know how he's going to separate himself from ways that he may profit from his own decisions. he's said of course he will divest. there will be no conflict of interest. i don't think he's explained that to most people's satisfaction, his supporters i'm sure have a lot of faith in him. i think his critics do not. they need to understand this. and i think they need understand it soon. it's going to be a big issue. he will not be able to avoid this in the first 100 days. i think if he wants to focus on his agenda, he'd better do it soon. >> jonathan, what do you think? how will democrats approach the potential conflicts? will fighting the accusation autos -- they're expected to consume his time. >> i think they'll sfe-- they'l spend talking about conflicts of interest and discussing why it's a political issue. it's the biggest political caudill they could have.
what will basically happen is they will day in, day out, week after week talk about all of the things that donald trump is doing that are at odds with his message of draining the swamp. >> jonathan allen, jane timm, thank you very much for spending your morning with us. >> thanks. >> take care. happening now, millions of americans caught in an arctic deep freeze. dropping temperatures below normal in at least 45 states. this as a storm packing snow, sleet, and freezing rain makes its way east. nbc's morgan rad sanford in sufficie suffern, new york. what it it like out there? >> reporter: good morning. 150,000 waking up to a winter weather advisory because of snowe and rain. the rain is expected to freeze throughout the day which is why people across the country are being asked to exercise extreme caution if they're leaving their homes, and especially if they're taking to these roads. a winter whiteout. blankets of snow barreling across the great plains, sending sheets of ice and howling winds
through america's heartland. slamming the northeast this morning. >> this is brutally cold. >> i don't know if you ever could be ready. >> i hate winter. >> reporter: out west, neighbors in wyoming race against the clock to clear snow-covered streets. >> even though it's 9 degrees out now, the temperatures are still supposed to keep dropping. >> reporter: hoping to avoid accidents like this in minnesota where icy roads caused hundreds of crashes in less than 24 hours and sent this tractor-trailer sliding off the highway. a similar scene in utah. bumper-to-bumper traffic at a standstill while hail pounded the ground. and this arctic sblaft just getting -- blast is just getting started. temperatures across the country dipping below zero this weekend, set to break record lows in cities like minneapolis, bismarck, pierre, and chicago. i high for sunday is expected to be negative 2. the first time the windy city
has seen a high below 0 in 33 years. next to the snow-covered crassharris, the northeast. firefighters in boston wrestled flames friday while battling windchill below zero. >> we've had significant issues around freezing. ladders are frozen. >> reporter: now facing more of that bone-chilling freeze, residents are taking matters into their own hands. >> people should stay inside. don't be outside. it's not worth it. >> reporter: up to eight inches of snow expected to slam the northeast here. hundreds of flights have already been canceled. this is as now 35 million americans are waking up to those dangerously cold windchill temperatures. dara? >> thanks for braving the cold for us this morning. tens of thousands including many children are hoping that they will be able to evacuate from aleppo today. nbc's bill neely is on the ground in syria with a look at the deaf station that they're trying to -- devastation that
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it is 13 past the hour here on msnbc live. now to president obama's year-end news conference. hans nichols has more from the white house on his reaction to the allegations of russian hacking and the election. if you could walk us through the highlights. >> reporter: the president spent most of his time explaining, you could say even defending his own administration's response to how it handled his own intelligence assessment that there was interference by the russians in the election. he shared an ane nenecdote of h warned putin to cut it out. at his year-end press conference, president barack obama revealed his warning to vladimir putin about interfering
in the 2016 presidential election. >> told him to cut it out. there were going to be serious consequences if he didn't. >> reporter: many in his party are frustrated that he didn't do more. obama's explanation offered little comfort to aggrieved democrats. >> i wanted to make sure that everybody understood we were playing this straight. we weren't trying to advantage one side or another. >> reporter: facing the press as reports emerge that the fbi agrees with the cia that the russian government by hacking into democratic emails tried to elect donald trump. the president refusing to go that far. >> we have not seen evidence of machines being tampered with. so that assurance i can provide. >> reporter: all but confirming an nbc news story that the russian president himself approved the cyberattacks. >> not much happens in russia without vladimir putin. >> reporter: a potential starting point for the senate intelligence committee which announced a hearing into the hacks led by senator richard burr who defended intelligence professionals, whose analysis has been questioned by
president-elect trump saying, "unlike many in washington, though, they check politics at the office door and focus on their mission." before leaving with his family for hawaii for the holidays, a mostly defensive president. a hint of offense. >> so at a point in time where we've taken certain actions that we can divulge publicly, we will do so. there are times that the message will go -- will be directly received by the russians and not publicized. >> reporter: that was the longest press conference in his presidency. he declined at several points to directly criticize his successor, president-elect trump. he even gave him a free pass on taking that phone call from the president of taiwan saying that all of u.s. foreign policy should be "subject to fresh eyes." dara? >> interesting few weeks ahead. thank you very much for that report. and donald trump wraps up his thank you tour today in alabama where he took home more than 60% of the vote on election day.
nbc's kelly o'donnell is in mobile, alabama, where the president-elect is set to take the stage in a few hours. good morning. what can we expect from the d ddon -- from donald trump today? >> reporter: good morning. this is the stadium where much later today the president-elect will be doing one of these campaign-style events that we've been seeing. what's sort of different today is that the other stops on this tour have largely been the surprise states that help him put together at that 270-plus that made him pinellas county. we know that -- him president-elect. we know that alabama is a reliable red state, so why come here? this is the home of his choice to be the next attorney general of the united states, alabama senator jeff sessions. and so this is part of a thank you tour that also thanks jeff sessions for his support. what we've also been seeing is that at these events, donald trump talks about a whole range of issues. on domestic policy and foreign policy. it's been very noticeable that the script he's been using has nothing to do with russia.
♪ back in rally mode. >> merry christmas, everyone. merry christmas. >> reporter: the president-elect took his thank you tour to orlando, florida, friday night. >> i love this state. i love the people. i love -- >> reporter: donald trump ignored the controversy over vladimir putin and russia's cyberattack on the u.s. election. hours earlier, president obama urged trump to publicly support the bipartisan investigation. team trump shifted the spotlight back to hillary clinton. >> this wouldn't have happened if hillary clinton didn't have a secret server. >> reporter: the hack hit the dnc, and a top aide's gmail account and not clinton's home server. in a speech to her campaign donors, clinton said her past criticism of putin's "illegitimate election" made her his target. >> vladimir putin himself directed the covert cyberattacks
against our electoral system, against our democracy, apparently because he has a personal beef against me. >> reporter: clinton blamed putin and the fbi letter about her e-mail investigation for her defeat. >> i happen to believe this, that that letter most likely made the difference in the outcome. >> reporter: preparing to leave the white house, first lady michelle obama hinted at her disappointment over the results in an interview with oprah winfrey. >> see, now we're feeling what not having hope feels like. you know? hope is necessary. it's a necessary concept. barak didn't just talk about hope because he thought it was just a nice slogan to get votes. he and i and so many believe that -- what else do you have if you don't have hope in?
yeah. >> reporter: mrs. obama did not mention donald trump specifically. she also referred to her husband, president obama, as being viewed by voters, she thinks, as a grown-up in the white house which may be in some way a comparison to donald trump. the current first family and future first family have something in common around there time of the year. we see that the obama family's already in hawaii for the holidays. the trumps will spend the rest of the holiday season based at their home in palm beach, florida. it's from there that the president-elect will continue to work on setting up his administration. dara, we don't have any indication if or when he'll speak more fully about or comment about this issue of the cyberattacks, the involvement of vladimir putin, and what the russians tried to do to influence the election. dara? >> so many questions. kelly o'donnell in mobile, alabama. thank you very much. breaking news out of aleppo. evacuations in rebel-held areas are expected to resume. this after a new deal was just
reached to free thousands trapped in the war-torn city. at least 7,500 were allowed to leave before vacations were suspended on friday. the syrian government and opposition groups blaming each other for a breakdown in the previous agreement. nbc chief global correspondent bill neely is in aleppo and has the latest on the all this. bill? >> reporter: the level of destruction in this city is really quite extraordinary. this is what four years of war has don aleppo. this area was under rebel control just a short time ago. the fighting in the city isn't over yet. there are warplanes in the sky as i speak. and civilians are still paying the price. smoke rising this morning from east aleppo where rebels still hold ground. its bombardment hasn't stopped. [ gunfire ] caught in the middle, people who thought they were about to escape. they've been gathering yesterday to leave the besieged east when
militias loyal to president assad opened fire. everyone fled. the cease-fire shattered yet again. desperate people driven back to what the u.n. calls hell. among them, 47 children, orphaned by the war. initial reports said they'd escaped two days ago, but the gunfire forced them back. still trapped are 7-year-old bana and her mother fatima. in desperation, appealing to michelle obama. >> i talk to you as a mother. >> reporter: they are surrounded by syrian troops and militias like hezbollah who handcuffed dozens of men leaving yesterday under a peace deal. their fate unknown. for many who did get out, emotional reunions for families they hadn't seen for years. escape from a city in ruins. the prize of a president. the victor in the long war here. the city took 4,000 years to
build and four years to tear down. this area is the grand mosque, 1,300 years old, and it's a mess. no sign that the tens of thousands civilians still trapped will be freed any time soon. >> thank you so much. bill neely covering that. now, how to prove russia actually interfered in the presidential election. we'll have the hard evidence.
trump and twitter. the president-elect's use of the social media platform is well known. and as of this morning, he's tweeted just over 34,000 times. what do americans think about all that tweeting? in a new mcclatchy/marrist survey, 66% of registered voters called it recoless and distracting. -- reckless and distracting. 21% think it's effective and
informative. it the rest are uncertain about his tweeting. donald trump and his new message to supporters his thank you tour. what he really meant up next. has been a struggle. i considered all my options with my doctor, who recommended once-daily toujeo®. now i'm on the path to better blood sugar control. toujeo® is a long-acting insulin from the makers of lantus®. it releases slowly, providing consistent insulin levels for a full 24 hours, proven full 24-hour blood sugar control,
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welcome back. i'm dara brown here at msnbc world headquarters in new york. at the half hour, here's what we're monitoring. a surge of brutally cold arctic air is icing roads and taking temperatures as low as single digits across the midwest. drivers are being warned to stay off the roads, while dozens of flights have already been canceled. winter storm warnings are in place from wyoming to wisconsin and up to maine. president obama says there will be retaliation for russia's interference in the election. but some of it may be covert. he answered several questions about it in his final presidential news conference of the year. in russia, the kremlin has demanded proof of claims that russia hacked into dnc computers. nbc's chief foreign correspondent, richard engle, is
in moscow. what's the reaction been both officially and also on the street? >> reporter: there's really been no reaction since the president spoke. the kremlin seems to be brushing off these latest statements by president obama. vladimir putin hasn't spoken. he's wrapped up a trip to japan. none of the top officials at the kremlin have been commenting. it is barely getting any attention on the state media either. when it is mentioned -- it is mentioned at all, it is the fifth or sixth item. and the reports that do get transmitted are effectively saying what russia has been saying consistently. that this is inner loop -- this is a hysterical effort by the democrats who are sore losers. that hillary clinton didn't win. that there has been no evidence presented to show that russia in fact did this. and one -- one commentator today was basically saying that --
that the u.s. is speaking out of both sides of its mouth trying to insult russia, saying that when the president said that russia's weak, doesn't produce anything that anyone wants to buy, is a poor country. and yet claiming that russia was so advanced that it managed to penetrate and influence the u.s. electoral system. but aside from that, generally they're brushing it off. >> and richard, we've been talking about the relationship between russia and the united states. what do you think the impression is of the people in russia? do you think that they're upset about this potential downturn in this relationship? >> reporter: i think they absolutely are upset about the downturn. for the last several years, relations between russia and the united states have been getting worse. i think they got probably reached their lowest point with events in crimea and ukraine and haven't really improved since then. but i think another reason that
they're not giving a lot of attention to what president obama said is they're looking to the next administration. they know they can effectively wait president obama out, and they're very much looking forward to the trump administration. trump is has made it clear that he wants better relations with russia. his pick for secretary of state, the exxonmobil ceo, someone who was given an order of friendship from russia, delivered to him by vladimir putin. so they think that just in a matter of weeks there could be a new chapter in relations between moscow and washington. >> and richard, i know you had the opportunity to meet with students in moscow. what's their impression of donald trump? >> reporter: this wasn't just any group of students. this was a kremlin-backed youth group. a group that is normally very patriotic. a group that produces videos, lionizing the state, often insulting to president obama,
are anti-american. when we were there, amid the shots of vladimir putin, you can see now one of the young artists was painting a portrait of donald trump. she's been painting several portraits of donald trump. and i think that reflects the mood here where people are looking to the next administration with a lot of -- a lot of enthusiasm. particularly a kremlin-backed group like that. and by the way eshe didn't faint that quickly. that's a bit of a time lapse. an interesting -- interesting painting. >> and she did a very good job on that. thank you very much for that report, richard. >> reporter: sure. let's bring in steve clemens, washington editor at large for "the atlantic" and msnbc contributor. great to have you. >> good morning. >> one of the biggest questions being raised by the skeptical on the reports is what does the hard evidence look like. can intelligence officials share proof to back these reports? and if so, what is it going to look like? >> i think that the intelligence officials can share elements of what they have with members of
congress that are in the intelligence committees. clearly, what has begun to happen, particularly with the fbi agreement yesterday that they concur with the cia's assessment that putin in russia tried to tilt this election by intervening in and hacking these files. and so you've seen the intelligence agencies, some of them creeping toward the conclusion. the cia was out ahead. and that's what we know from the outside. what i know from talking to legislators, both republican and democrat that are privy to some of the files, is that they are getting briefings from people that the american public is not. and you've got things like means and methods, and you have intelligence coming forward that, frankly, in a tit for tat we may not want russia to know everything we have. there is a gap between what you and i are going to see as public citizens and what someone like senator mccain or joe marchen will get in their intelligence and security briefings. those people i've talked to who i think that have, you know, the national interests at heart seem
convinced by the voracity of intelligence that they've been briefed on by the cia. >> steven cohen, a russian studies professor, cautioned against these intel assessments on the brian lehrer show on npr earlier this week. let's take a listen. >> until they do an actual estimate which would take months, until they do it, you can't talk about any consensus in our intelligence agencies. what they're talking about are assessments, opinions, and not telling us what facts they base that on. and meanwhile, meanwhile, we're polluting our discourse about russia during an exceedingly dangerous time in our relations with russia. >> do you think there's a reason to be concerned about this leading to entertained dangers? >> steven cohen is one of our nation's great russia experts. i have tremendous respect for him, and i disagree in this count because this issue of
russian meddling and russian hacking in our electoral system, in the dnc files, in john podesta's emails, is something that has been brewing for a period of time. and we've had, you know, fbi and cia folks whovert of have monitored this -- this didn't just happen. it's been growing. coming after the election saying, how much damage did it really make. steven is saying he wants to have the bureaucratic process of the syntheization to come out with a branded statement. i don't think that's the way the world works. this has happened. it's had an impact. it may not affect the electoral outcome. it's very important that we know in realtime what the russians have done and what our eventually abilities are. and while i respect -- steven has been arguing for a long time that russia has felt humiliated by the united states, angry at the united states, that we're misreading the opportunities for u.s./russia relations. some of that i agree with, but that doesn't mean that one has
to look at russia as a benign actor. russia is a mall igyant actor in this case and has gone into the core of our democratic process which ought to be as core national interest as any of our other national interests. i think he's reading it wrong in this case. >> to that point, president obama spoke yesterday about how the u.s. may respond to russia. here's a part of that. >> there are times where the message will go -- will be directly received by the russians and not publicized. >> so what could the u.s. do to respond as president obama suggests? and can the u.s. target something before president obama actually leaves office? >> it's very frustrating. look, i have great respect for president obama. saying that we might, you know, punch the russians or show the russians what our muscle looks like covertly behind the scenes, that's not something that needs to be said. what needed to happen was that signaling to russia of our capacity should have happened
before. i asked a cabinet-level national security official ten days before the election in one of our kinds of regular sort of off-the-record meetings, to what degree russia mattered, to what degree russian hacking and concerns over it were -- were, you know, palpable. and we ought to be -- i was told that the administration had it under control, that it had signaled to the russians to back off. and our best read was that they were backing off. we know that was inaccurate. and it's remarkable that we weren't showing some capacity to at least deter the russians before this point. so while i admire obama's general strategic restraint at times, in this particular area, it comes off as weakness. and it's the kind of thing that, yes, we may show vladimir putin what we know he had for dinner last night or something naughty that he and others have done -- you may remember after the sochi olympics, we spent a lot of time tracking down the cronies around putin who were engaged in the
corruption around those olympics. and we sanctioned individuals after the ukraine incursion. we didn't sanction the russian government. we went after individuals and people. and i think that has been part of the tension between putin and us. we already know a great deal about how his money has flown all around, and there are some estimates that vladimir putin himself controls about $85 billion privately around the world. that may be the kind of thing that president obama may be intermating. >> and steve, it real quick. we learned yesterday that a chinese naval vessel seized a u.s. navy underwater glider that was collecting scientific data in international waters in the south china sea. why would china do this? do you think they're trying to send a message? >> of course. china's always trying to send a message. and it's trying to send a message that that zone is their territory, and under their sovereignty. and the united states and other nations in the region, vietnam, the philippines to some degree,
even under duterte, are disputing that. and saying that the sea lanes, these islands are not china's. and so we continue to try to operate both with ships, with military activities, and this was a drone that was out there looking at the selinity of the water. they're trying to send a signal like china's done in the past with air identification zones where planes have to notify the chinese government that they're flying to airspace that china's just decided is its own. this is a part of disputed tear torques and they're trying to send a signal. >> how will this ♪ >> homey through smart negotiation -- hopefully through smart negotiations. president obama tries to not let things ruffle him but sends a message that there are areas where the united states and china can collaborate and work together. there are going to be areas where we don't see eye to to
eye. we need to manage through areas of conflict. donald trump now is sending signals that he's ready to kind of take on china and be more aggressive. we're going to see how the two test each other, how china tests trump and how trump tests china and these kind of antics are going to be part of that dance between them. >> always great to have you. thanks for your insight. >> thank you. ivanka trump already taking an active role in her father's administration by calling members of congress about legislation. now the new questions about when she's carrotsing the line. and -- crossing the line. and the next hour, donald trump turning down daily briefings. a former intelligence officer tells us about the important information he could be missing. little dakota's nose was quivering in fear.
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important vicious, violent, screaming, "where's the wall? we want the wall!" now you're laid-back, you're cool, mellow, right? you're basking in the glory of victory. [ cheers ] and we're already getting to work. >> that was president-elect trump last night in florida. the latest stop on his post-election thank you tour. he'll lead to mobile, alabama, to wrap up the six-state swing. let's bring in joe watkins, strategist and former aide to p. george h.w. bush, and rick tyler, former national spokesman forred at t for ted cruz and msnbc analyst. sarah, trump spent more than a year encouraging this rhetoric and now saying it's terrible. does he really think it's terrible? what's going on here? >> well, i think some of this is the press once again struggling
to find a way to cover who donald trump says. he is talking about how great it is for supporters there he won and the press is instead concentrating on this one aspect of what he said. i think they're missing the point. he's enjoying the win with his supporters. that's why they're having the thank you tour. i wouldn't take it quite so literally about what he was talking about before the election. obviously emotions were high on both sides before the election. now the election's over, time to move ahead for the country. >> joe, if this was serious, does trump really think he can get the genie back in the bottle as it were and suddenly roll out a whole new style? the whole new way of talking? >> well, toning it down is a good thing. i think sarah makes a great point. the challenge is for the president-elect to bring the country together because the country's been divided. it was a tough election, and emotions did run high, indeed. the challenge is to make sure what he's saying translates into actual policy. and for instance his justice department stays strong in terms of defending the rights of
americans whose justices -- whose rights have been infringed upon. so if his justice department and others in the administration make sure that the rights of all americans are protected, indeed tensions will simmer down. >> monica langley of the "wall street journal" has been reporting inside the trump camp. and here she is explaining their thinking on why trump shouldn't sell off his businesses. >> first, everybody thought, well, if you sold it, it would be a fire sale. how can you put all these properties on the market all at once? what they're finding is that so many potential people might want to buy a trump property, especially in foreign countries. it could be a foreign entity, foreign person, sovereign wealth fund. they could go for really high prices. as one person said today, right now it's a no-win situation. if we sold these properties for really high prices, people would say, oh, we're taking advantage. >> a fire sale. rick, how do you interpret this?
>> i think -- she may be right. look, this is complicated. we've had wealthy people run before. and often if they get to a position of power, they've got to liquidate. that usually means selling off stocks. it doesn't mean selling off one's family business that they've worked on for 30 years. and he has over 500 different businesses, llcs, s corps, c corps, and it would be difficult to sell. this is something we have to live with and work through. i think what donald trump could help himself with is transparency. and one of the things he has not been transparent about is his taxes. and if people could see his taxes, they could judge for themselves what the conflicts of interest are, and we could judge them going forward. now we can't. >> and those taxes are still a sticking point. joe, why is this question of divestment becoming the american people's problem? i mean, shouldn't trump have figured this out during the year plus that he was running for president? >> no. well, when you run for the
presidency, it really is an all-encompassing thing. certainly wasn't guaranteed when he first started that he was going to win. i remember being in conversations a little more than a year ago when people were expecting him to drop out. obviously he won the nomination and managed also to win the presidency. so now he'ses got to turn his -- he's got to turn his attention to how he handles the matter. it won't be easy. with over 500 businesses, it's not a matter of walking away or just saying, my kids will run them all. there's a lot to be done here. this is -- this is going to take time to figure out. >> one of those issues, sarah, is that ivanka trump has reportedly been calling members of congress about childcare legislation. there's a lot of questions here about exactly what her role will be or should be in the administration. is she crossing a line here? >> oh, i don't think so. we have a long tradition of first family members being involved at the pleasure of the president. you look at john f. kennedy's brother was obviously the attorney general, something that
we're not coming closes to this time around. hillary clinton was hugely involved in her husband's first term administration doing health care. so i don't think it's unusual for the first daughter take the to take on the role similar to that as a first lady, and alice roosevelt did it for teddy roosevelt, and when it comes to climate change and some of the other issues that we is seen her potentially try to tackle, it could run into an issue with her father's policy proposals. i don't see him putting left wing ideology ahead of other things in the country, but when it comes to things like child care and these noncontroversial traditionally first lady roles, i think ivanka trump would be well suited. >> the nepotism laws went into affect after the kennedy administration, so rick would this really work? >> well, she's going to act as a
senior adviser, and i think sarah is right in the way hillary clinton did, and this goes back to the adams administration, the second president, and jackson's daughter-in-law was pretty involved in certain aspects of the jackson administration, and as long as she doesn't have a paid or official role, she clearly has the ear of the president and will continue to do so i believe. >> stick around, and we will be back because one of michelle's final interviews, and we will hear what she told oprah winfrey. i said, "delivering to you is always a special treat." oh. company, companionship, food... we all need those things. when we get in that spot in life, it's kind of nice to have 'em there. (avo) through the subaru share the love event, we've helped deliver over one point four million meals to those in need. get a new subaru, and we'll donate
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hope is necessary. it's a necessary concept. >> let's bring back our panel. rick, let's start with you because we talked many times to voters saying it was about voting for the lesser of two evils and would that suggest that hope was not part of the equati equation? >> that's a good question. there was not a lot of forward visionary hopeful thinking, but i did think the people that voted for donald trump were hoping for change, and i think about 62% of americans now believe that donald trump will change washington, and i hope that he does change. michelle said some very important things in the interview, and both her and the president talked about, you know, they were simply americans and skin color is skin deep and i think that's important. i would say identity politics doesn't seem, to me, to be a
very progressive idea. >> joe, quick, do you think voters felt helpless? >> i don't think so. there were a lot of voters that felt angry and felt left out, and i still think there's lots of hope. we have to hope because we all want america to get better, for it to be a better place for everybody and so we have to have hope. >> sarah, do you think that the voters were actually hopeless or do you think that trump can take this and become the unifier that he is talking about he can become? >> no, i think unfortunately the barack obamas have been living in a little bit of a bubble. democrats have lost over 900 legislative seats, and 12 governor ships, and 69 house seats and 13 senate seats, and democrats are the ones feeling hopeless at this point but for a lot of the country this is the change they have actually been waiting for, and they want to fix the broken bureaucracy that has been taking over washington
like a spreading disease, so i think there's a lot of hope out there that things can move in the right direction, and unfortunately, i don't think the democrats and obamas get it yet. >> what about trump? do you think he could be a uny y unifi unifier? >> i hope so, and we'll see. and it does mean a lot of hope for lot of people out there. >> thank you. i am daria brown, and thank you for watching, and betty nguyen takes over at the top of the hour, and she will speak about the information they have received in russia's possible role in hacking the election.
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